If every sperm is sacred, I hate to inform you that millions are wasted every day. A woman can waste an egg a month.
Because something has potential, does make it so. Not even conception confers a brain capable of consciousness.
Should we fertilize every egg because of the simple fact it exists? Find a way to make every sperm into its intended purpose?
What of the girl who is real? Who does have people in the world who love her?
A collection of cells is just that. It has the potential, but a seed should not be loved for a tree.
Not if the ground is still a corn field not yet ripe. The corn deserves the ability to make mistakes, mature and someday give a good bed to another tree some ways down the road.
You can entertain whichever fantasy you wish, me too.
I know that people born into poverty are likely to stay there. A girl who was too irresponsible to not get pregnant is now all of sudden ready to raise a child and still try and achieve her dreams.
No, committing a child and their mother to a life of poverty and lack of a dream is murder.
It is this ridiculous philosophy that the universe has some angry god with very specific rules up there that condemns people to a life of hardship.
The collection of cells [depending on level of maturity] cannot have a human identity, does not have a world that cares for it [like the girl about to throw her life away if she keeps it].
The girl is more important. To her family, to her friends, and to the child which she will have later in life [who will be cared for with the money and security today requires] that would have been lost to fate if she had taken the hard road which YOU are prescribing her.
Thats not fair, its not your choice, its not your life.
If the lady was walking around pregnant, she probably wanted the child and planned to raise the seed until it becomes a full human being. That would be the crux of the issue.
Irresponsibility is the reason she SHOULD get an abortion [to me], not a reason to keep it.
Fate is fate. She could have the child now and kill the the life and child she might have had later.
No one will cry for the child never conceived, but how hard will the life be of a baby born into the arms of young, irresponsible single mother? Often quite hard.
Now if she waits, she may find happiness with another and have the money to send her kids to a nice school and provide a nice house. To me, that would be moral.
About 2/3 of fertilized eggs do not end up growing into a fetus/baby. Should we be charging women with assisted suicide or child negligence for the fertilized eggs that don't survive?
Especially responsibility for fiscal, legal, or social matters.
Bringing a child into the world is not an 'opportunity' to teach someone how irresponsible theyve been. Bringing a child into the world is as much for the child [more I think] then it is for the mother.
If the mother isnt ready, what kind of life is that for the child?
The universe has no ultimate morality, no objective god.
That's called snark. I'm using sarcasm to make a point. The catholic church is in the news today, and now so is OWS. If you're going to cheer for one group, and condemn another, when they're both guilty of the same thing, that's hypocrisy.
"After DNA has combined between the parents and cell division begins it is alive"
Well - in the course of a few minutes, you have gone from "heart beating" to cell division.
And, "If you don't kill it it will become a baby". Well - the same could be said about the sperm that spilled into the condom (which is how the Catholic church defines it).
Even the Roe decision addressed this - it talked about being "viable" - i.e., living outside the mother's womb - which is around 6 months+.
I am comfortable with defining some sort of "life" as anything between full brain development and viability.
We probably won't agree. But, talking about embryos and fetuses and stages of development is much more productive than "murderer" and "unborn babies".
Which is why, as you said, we shouldn't blur the lines.
crosstime_saloonFeb 11, 2012Buried
Simple message: Better fund Planned Parenthood. Simple math: more education + more contraception = fewer abortions. Favorite message: Enjoy sex!
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
Murders?
If every sperm is sacred, I hate to inform you that millions are wasted every day. A woman can waste an egg a month.
Because something has potential, does make it so. Not even conception confers a brain capable of consciousness.
Should we fertilize every egg because of the simple fact it exists? Find a way to make every sperm into its intended purpose?
What of the girl who is real? Who does have people in the world who love her?
A collection of cells is just that. It has the potential, but a seed should not be loved for a tree.
Not if the ground is still a corn field not yet ripe. The corn deserves the ability to make mistakes, mature and someday give a good bed to another tree some ways down the road.
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
You can entertain whichever fantasy you wish, me too.
I know that people born into poverty are likely to stay there. A girl who was too irresponsible to not get pregnant is now all of sudden ready to raise a child and still try and achieve her dreams.
Its suicide, and its being prescribed as moral.
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
No, committing a child and their mother to a life of poverty and lack of a dream is murder.
It is this ridiculous philosophy that the universe has some angry god with very specific rules up there that condemns people to a life of hardship.
The collection of cells [depending on level of maturity] cannot have a human identity, does not have a world that cares for it [like the girl about to throw her life away if she keeps it].
The girl is more important. To her family, to her friends, and to the child which she will have later in life [who will be cared for with the money and security today requires] that would have been lost to fate if she had taken the hard road which YOU are prescribing her.
Thats not fair, its not your choice, its not your life.
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
@ganjadude:
I dont know, I dont make the laws.
To me it seems simple, though.
If the lady was walking around pregnant, she probably wanted the child and planned to raise the seed until it becomes a full human being. That would be the crux of the issue.
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
Irresponsibility is the reason she SHOULD get an abortion [to me], not a reason to keep it.
Fate is fate. She could have the child now and kill the the life and child she might have had later.
No one will cry for the child never conceived, but how hard will the life be of a baby born into the arms of young, irresponsible single mother? Often quite hard.
Now if she waits, she may find happiness with another and have the money to send her kids to a nice school and provide a nice house. To me, that would be moral.
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
Depending on the stage of development, it has the rudimentary heart of a multi-celled organism.
Throughout the maturation of the human fetus, we see our evolutionary history. From early fish, to late mammal, and eventually -a full human being.
Cells are organized in such a such structure is not a testament of personhood.
mtownFeb 12, 2012Buried
About 2/3 of fertilized eggs do not end up growing into a fetus/baby. Should we be charging women with assisted suicide or child negligence for the fertilized eggs that don't survive?
geejayeFeb 11, 2012Buried
And, an embryo is not a baby. Blurring the line is bulls**t spinning.
geejayeFeb 11, 2012Buried
"t has a heartbeat" - when the embryo is 5 weeks old.
So:
* a women finds she missed her period within 2 weeks of sex
* she takes the drugstore test
* she has an abortion before the 5 week mark
By your own definition, then, she has not "murdered", since the embryo's heart isn't beating.
And, by your own definition, morning after pills are just fine.
THIS is why we should not blur the lines...
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
@dp
Haha, good one there.
I would say the baby is fully realized [generally] at some number of weeks.
I dont know it, but I take it at least we can speak about such an idea?
crom99Feb 11, 2012Buried
You mean like the Catholic church?
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
I agree with you when it comes to most matters.
Especially responsibility for fiscal, legal, or social matters.
Bringing a child into the world is not an 'opportunity' to teach someone how irresponsible theyve been. Bringing a child into the world is as much for the child [more I think] then it is for the mother.
If the mother isnt ready, what kind of life is that for the child?
The universe has no ultimate morality, no objective god.
Why condemn someone?
bookantFeb 12, 2012Buried
"How's does poverty excuse irresponsibility?"
Exactly what "irresponsiblity" are you talking about?
FrankLuskaFeb 12, 2012Buried
Consider spamming somewhere else.
FrankLuskaFeb 12, 2012Buried
That's easy, just watch CSPAN, if those idiots in congress don't anger you, you just don't care.
crom99Feb 11, 2012Buried
That's called snark. I'm using sarcasm to make a point. The catholic church is in the news today, and now so is OWS. If you're going to cheer for one group, and condemn another, when they're both guilty of the same thing, that's hypocrisy.
geejayeFeb 11, 2012Buried
"After DNA has combined between the parents and cell division begins it is alive"
Well - in the course of a few minutes, you have gone from "heart beating" to cell division.
And, "If you don't kill it it will become a baby". Well - the same could be said about the sperm that spilled into the condom (which is how the Catholic church defines it).
Even the Roe decision addressed this - it talked about being "viable" - i.e., living outside the mother's womb - which is around 6 months+.
I am comfortable with defining some sort of "life" as anything between full brain development and viability.
We probably won't agree. But, talking about embryos and fetuses and stages of development is much more productive than "murderer" and "unborn babies".
Which is why, as you said, we shouldn't blur the lines.
laborerFeb 11, 2012Buried
You mean like you dont care what happens, so long as the raper's are voting on your side?
Nasty.
laborerFeb 12, 2012Buried
That is the Liberal Way.