I live in Wheaton, IL. Look it up. It's basically god's home town here in America. Being an atheist in this town is interesting. I really just keep my feelings and beliefs to myself and do not discuss them. Most would not know that I'm an atheist because they wouldn't like it. Atheism is for sure taboo and it's one that you can safely be bigoted about.
i live in kansas... i don't find much issue with individuals. in fact, when we were fighting creationism being taught in our schools we showed up at board meetings thinking we were in for a fight and found out both atheist and religious were dead set against it. there really was no one in support of it.
what we found out was the entire issue was being financed and supported from outside kansas. this is where i think things have gone wrong. religion by nature is a "me too" issue. just for that one instant people were fired up enough to fight. there were more non-believers than show up in the polls.
where i find religion problematic are in the ways it is eroding our society. when religion is right there in your face and as individuals you need to fight it people will step up.
but most of the damage being done by religion is a step removed and people find it easiest to know the nightmare will end in a few years... religion is politics in america and the middle east. its destructive in america and the middle east.
Very interesting story...one tends to forget about atheism as taboo, at least in my world. Freedom of religion or lack thereof is so simple, why can't we all just get along. lmao.
It's a matter of hubris. Some Americans just can't keep their opinions to themselves. Politics and religion are volatile subjects, and bringing them up when you don't know the other person well (or worse, know they disagree with you) is arrogant and rude. If anything, it's worse with religion because people feel more strongly about it than, say, a political candidate.
Seems like it's worse in small towns. People feel more comfortable bringing up volatile subjects like religion and politics, because they assume everyone else must be just like them.
There should be no question of any supreme being. What the hell are you all talking about!? Hello!! It's like we're living in tribes worshiping fake gods now. Isn't the 21 centuary? The centuary where we enjoy ipads, cell phones, internet and abundant information? This whole god thing is a rudiment of our dark past where peoples were fooled by false selfish prophets to gain themselves adoration and uniqueness. I can't believe americans are such blind assh**es!
If I would own a shop in the States, and would say to customers after serving them 'God won't bless you if he does not exist' instead of 'God bless' you would see where the discrimination comes in.
I have to listen daily to this 'God bless you' crap without being able to politely say 'well, I am sorry, but you are delusional'. That would just be rude.
Not believing in deities doesn't mean you don't have a belief system. It's just a different belief system. Some believe you should do good because God will punish you if you don't. Others believe that the good in the world is a sum product of our individual good deeds, and that alone is reason enough to be good.
The thing that's odd about your comment, is that atheists have no reason to talk about Christianity to Christians in a condescending way, unless Christians bring up religion or the "flaws" in not having one. Saying that atheists have an un-provoked or un-influenced negative "opinion" on Christianity is like saying someone in no way acquainted with football has an opinion on who wins today's Super Bowl.
There's a lot of arrogance on both sides. Either way, the problem comes when one thinks their beliefs supersede the beliefs of others.
An example of arrogance: similar to the experience mentioned in the article, I've been in volunteer situations where the first thing they did was tell everyone to pray. Most of the volunteers were from my tech company, hardly a religious group. There was a big empty room adjacent; they could have just said those who want to pray could join them there, but instead they had the hubris to foist it on everyone. It went on awhile. As I uncomfortably peered among the group, I could see others doing the same. The tension & discomfort eventually wore off after the "Amen", but it really didn't start things on a good footing and most of us never volunteered there again.
WHWAAAAAAT?? Point, Texas!!!?? I use to live there! That place is full of assh**es. I got sent to the office for not calling a subsitute teacher ma'am one day. Another day I got paddled (hit with a board) for throwing staples in class (I do not dispute that I did indeed throw staples, but really? and I got paddled on several occasions for similar stupid stuff). In that school kids can't wear shorts except for the first and last six weeks of school, because girls legs are distracting. For two days one of our science teachers talked to us about big foot and chubacabra. He swore up and down that him and a fishing buddy saw big foot tracks one day.
That place is so backwards. What a horrible experience that was, living there and having to deal with those people.
With that said I didn't read the article past that point because my mind was blown.
It's really bizarre to hear about Kansas from the outside - news media makes it sound like it's full of religious extremists. I went to high school and college there and I don't even recall creationism ever being discussed. It was a small town so everybody went to church, but the night before we were all drinking and screwing (there was not a lot else to do in a small town in the 70s).
You can talk about homo sexuality. People grasp the concept. Unfortunately, many people cannot understand that there are people WITHOUT a belief system at all. They cannot understand the concept. Which means, it cannot be properly discussed - you would be seen as a sad misguided sociopath.
It is much, much worse with religion because religion is a matter of faith, and thus can't be argued logically. Or rather one side can debate it logically, while the other just refuses to apply logic to it.
With politics at least you can try to pick apart various positions and opinions and try to use various historical pieces of evidence. With religion that unfortunately is impossible. When presented with logic and evidence many religious people just lash out in fear and anger.
Norman, I agree that there are most likely alien beings out there somewhere who are smarter than the human race. They might live in the Milky Way (out own little galaxy) or in a different, much older, start system.
There is even something to believe that life on Earth was sprouted from contaminated meteors.
However, there is no physical evidence of beings, superior or not, who have any control over the human race. Good thing too. That would mean the whole Human Race would be in slavery.
If you try to tell me that the world is <10,000 years old, or that we should deny civil liberties because your bronze-age myths say so, I will talk to you like the ignorant child you are.
If you want to talk about the philosophy of ethics in the context of theological and secular paradigms, I will talk to you like the adult you are.
No, there is actually a ton of discrimination against atheists that's more than just trying to "save" them. Obviously it's not nearly as bad as some gays have it, but the discrimination is there. People hate and fear atheists - not enough to beat them to death, but more than enough to force them out of their jobs, ostracize them, insult them, etc.
crashdvisFeb 5, 2012Buried
I live in Wheaton, IL. Look it up. It's basically god's home town here in America. Being an atheist in this town is interesting. I really just keep my feelings and beliefs to myself and do not discuss them. Most would not know that I'm an atheist because they wouldn't like it. Atheism is for sure taboo and it's one that you can safely be bigoted about.
starmanjonesFeb 5, 2012Buried
i live in kansas... i don't find much issue with individuals. in fact, when we were fighting creationism being taught in our schools we showed up at board meetings thinking we were in for a fight and found out both atheist and religious were dead set against it. there really was no one in support of it.
what we found out was the entire issue was being financed and supported from outside kansas. this is where i think things have gone wrong. religion by nature is a "me too" issue. just for that one instant people were fired up enough to fight. there were more non-believers than show up in the polls.
where i find religion problematic are in the ways it is eroding our society. when religion is right there in your face and as individuals you need to fight it people will step up.
but most of the damage being done by religion is a step removed and people find it easiest to know the nightmare will end in a few years... religion is politics in america and the middle east. its destructive in america and the middle east.
jeremerg82Feb 5, 2012Buried
Very interesting story...one tends to forget about atheism as taboo, at least in my world. Freedom of religion or lack thereof is so simple, why can't we all just get along. lmao.
bdbrFeb 5, 2012Buried
It's a matter of hubris. Some Americans just can't keep their opinions to themselves. Politics and religion are volatile subjects, and bringing them up when you don't know the other person well (or worse, know they disagree with you) is arrogant and rude. If anything, it's worse with religion because people feel more strongly about it than, say, a political candidate.
Seems like it's worse in small towns. People feel more comfortable bringing up volatile subjects like religion and politics, because they assume everyone else must be just like them.
starfishsystemsFeb 5, 2012Buried
"I've been in volunteer situations where the first thing they did was tell everyone to pray."
That is so creepy.
martov2010Feb 5, 2012Buried
There should be no question of any supreme being. What the hell are you all talking about!? Hello!! It's like we're living in tribes worshiping fake gods now. Isn't the 21 centuary? The centuary where we enjoy ipads, cell phones, internet and abundant information? This whole god thing is a rudiment of our dark past where peoples were fooled by false selfish prophets to gain themselves adoration and uniqueness. I can't believe americans are such blind assh**es!
breadfredFeb 5, 2012Buried
If I would own a shop in the States, and would say to customers after serving them 'God won't bless you if he does not exist' instead of 'God bless' you would see where the discrimination comes in.
I have to listen daily to this 'God bless you' crap without being able to politely say 'well, I am sorry, but you are delusional'. That would just be rude.
breadfredFeb 5, 2012Buried
Stupidity is not limited to a single country.
bdbrFeb 5, 2012Buried
Not believing in deities doesn't mean you don't have a belief system. It's just a different belief system. Some believe you should do good because God will punish you if you don't. Others believe that the good in the world is a sum product of our individual good deeds, and that alone is reason enough to be good.
ericschc1Feb 5, 2012Buried
The thing that's odd about your comment, is that atheists have no reason to talk about Christianity to Christians in a condescending way, unless Christians bring up religion or the "flaws" in not having one. Saying that atheists have an un-provoked or un-influenced negative "opinion" on Christianity is like saying someone in no way acquainted with football has an opinion on who wins today's Super Bowl.
bdbrFeb 5, 2012Buried
There's a lot of arrogance on both sides. Either way, the problem comes when one thinks their beliefs supersede the beliefs of others.
An example of arrogance: similar to the experience mentioned in the article, I've been in volunteer situations where the first thing they did was tell everyone to pray. Most of the volunteers were from my tech company, hardly a religious group. There was a big empty room adjacent; they could have just said those who want to pray could join them there, but instead they had the hubris to foist it on everyone. It went on awhile. As I uncomfortably peered among the group, I could see others doing the same. The tension & discomfort eventually wore off after the "Amen", but it really didn't start things on a good footing and most of us never volunteered there again.
luke1h7Feb 5, 2012Buried
WHWAAAAAAT?? Point, Texas!!!?? I use to live there! That place is full of assh**es. I got sent to the office for not calling a subsitute teacher ma'am one day. Another day I got paddled (hit with a board) for throwing staples in class (I do not dispute that I did indeed throw staples, but really? and I got paddled on several occasions for similar stupid stuff). In that school kids can't wear shorts except for the first and last six weeks of school, because girls legs are distracting. For two days one of our science teachers talked to us about big foot and chubacabra. He swore up and down that him and a fishing buddy saw big foot tracks one day.
That place is so backwards. What a horrible experience that was, living there and having to deal with those people.
With that said I didn't read the article past that point because my mind was blown.
bdbrFeb 5, 2012Buried
It's really bizarre to hear about Kansas from the outside - news media makes it sound like it's full of religious extremists. I went to high school and college there and I don't even recall creationism ever being discussed. It was a small town so everybody went to church, but the night before we were all drinking and screwing (there was not a lot else to do in a small town in the 70s).
breadfredFeb 5, 2012Buried
You can talk about homo sexuality. People grasp the concept. Unfortunately, many people cannot understand that there are people WITHOUT a belief system at all. They cannot understand the concept. Which means, it cannot be properly discussed - you would be seen as a sad misguided sociopath.
elimgarakFeb 5, 2012Buried
It is much, much worse with religion because religion is a matter of faith, and thus can't be argued logically. Or rather one side can debate it logically, while the other just refuses to apply logic to it.
With politics at least you can try to pick apart various positions and opinions and try to use various historical pieces of evidence. With religion that unfortunately is impossible. When presented with logic and evidence many religious people just lash out in fear and anger.
breadfredFeb 5, 2012Buried
Norman, I agree that there are most likely alien beings out there somewhere who are smarter than the human race. They might live in the Milky Way (out own little galaxy) or in a different, much older, start system.
There is even something to believe that life on Earth was sprouted from contaminated meteors.
However, there is no physical evidence of beings, superior or not, who have any control over the human race. Good thing too. That would mean the whole Human Race would be in slavery.
apokalyps2547Feb 5, 2012Buried
If you try to tell me that the world is <10,000 years old, or that we should deny civil liberties because your bronze-age myths say so, I will talk to you like the ignorant child you are.
If you want to talk about the philosophy of ethics in the context of theological and secular paradigms, I will talk to you like the adult you are.
elimgarakFeb 5, 2012Buried
No, there is actually a ton of discrimination against atheists that's more than just trying to "save" them. Obviously it's not nearly as bad as some gays have it, but the discrimination is there. People hate and fear atheists - not enough to beat them to death, but more than enough to force them out of their jobs, ostracize them, insult them, etc.
theswashbucklerFeb 5, 2012Buried
wow, need some more straw for that strawman you built?
elimgarakFeb 5, 2012Buried
Dog spelled backwards. :-)